When the Giants Come to Town, It's Bye-Bye Baby

04.16.2008
Shortstop 2009

Omar Vizquel is moping about, his return from knee surgery delayed indefinitely. He told the Merc he wouldn’t be as agile when he returned. Could this in fact be the end of his career, the final injury that never quite heals and prompts the proud Vizquel, who’s got a full life of music and art and general supercoolness going for him off the diamond, to walk away?

If so, what are the Giants options at shortstop? In the previous thread Cyrus asked for more Bocock the rest of the year, but be careful what you ask for. Young Brian is starting to look lost, nearly leading the league in strikeouts as pitchers go right after him.

His D is excellent, but unless he turns a corner offensively, he’ll be lucky to hit .150 / .250 / .200. (He’s currently at .174 / .296 / .196, for an OPS of .492. Worst OPS by a qualifying batter this decade? Minnesota’s Nick Punto, with .562 last year.)

Bocock will draw the occasional walk from a pitcher with control problems, and he’ll squeeze the occasional single through the infield, but he’ll be as close to an automatic out as you get in the bigs. Prove me wrong, Brian, please.

Making matters worse, there is no one to back him up. Bochy pinch-hit for him in the 9th inning yesterday, but I have no idea who would have played short if the game advanced into extra innings. Aurilia or Castillo could play an inning or two, I guess. The Giants don’t trust Velez at third base; they certainly won’t play him at short.

Then there’s 2009. Even if Vizquel returns fairly soon, he probably won’t play enough to vest his ‘09 option. The chance of him returning next year is practically nil. Should the Giants keep it in the organization? Bocock? Burriss? Ochoa? Or is it time to start thinking about free agents or trades? 

The main question to consider: can Bocock’s offense improve enough to justify playing him every day? On a team with many other offensive options, the Giants might be able to afford his weak bat. Might. When he’s in, he and the pitcher make for six or seven nearly automatic outs per game. The Giants can ill-afford automatic outs.

I cautiously say keep him in ‘09, but only upon three conditions:

1) Add a couple real bats next year (hopefully from within the organization);

2) Find a utility infielder who can back up Bocock at short and provide a decent bat, so the Giants can pinch-hit for him without too much worry;

3) Show obvious improvement this year. He doesn’t need to be a league-average SS with the bat by September, but a descent into all-time horribleness does nothing for him or the team. I recommend that he learn how to bunt any pitch, on any count, to either side of the diamond. That will at least cut down on strikeouts, move runners over, draw in the corner infielders and help a few of his liners and ground balls sneak through.

What say you? Bocock, Burriss, Ochoa? Are there any free agents you’re keen to sign this coming winter? Should the Giants trade for talent at SS when they so many other holes to fill? Discuss.







[April 16, 2008 4:38 PM]  |  link  |  reply
Mark O'Connor said

I think Burriss has to be the go-to guy. He skipped AA, if he gets a year a AAA he could be ready (age 24) next year. We have Ochoa, who I think is AAAA at best, but he could probably out-hit Bo-co one-handed. I like the kid, his fielding and poise are impressive, but he really deserves some proper AA or AAA time to learn to hit.

[April 17, 2008 1:04 AM]  |  link  |  reply
Aaron B. said

Grant over at McCovey Chronicles had a good idea. Ben Zobrist. very good reasoning too.

http://www.mccoveychronicles.com/2008/2/27/153521/477

[April 17, 2008 8:57 AM]  |  link  |  reply
tito fuentes said

brent lillibridge. and right now the braves are pretty desperate for pitching - starter and late innings.

[April 17, 2008 11:42 AM]  |  link  |  reply
ELM replied to tito fuentes

Tito, welcome. You're better than Ray Durham.

[April 17, 2008 11:59 AM]  |  link  |  reply
ELM replied to tito fuentes

I just noticed: Lillibridge is off to a worse start than Burriss.

[April 17, 2008 10:05 AM]  |  link  |  reply
Chris said

My hope is that Burriss has a respectable year in AAA and heads into '09 as the guy. His bat isn't strong but its stronger than Bocock's and his D is supposed to be good, too.

[April 17, 2008 11:57 AM]  |  link  |  reply
ELM replied to Chris

It would be nice if Burriss stepped up in AAA this year, but it seems a longshot. He couldn't hack high-A last year. By March 2009, his offense might be better than Bocock's, but how much better? Enough to make up for his inferior defense, relative to Bocock? And if so, will even that be enough to merit a big league job? It's something to monitor.

So far the results in AAA aren't promising: a .304 OBP and .296 SLG -- 1 XBH in 54 ABs.

[April 17, 2008 1:42 PM]  |  link  |  reply
Chris replied to ELM

You're right that Burriss still has a long way to go, especially with the bat. I don't mind that the Giants are a little aggressive with him and promoted him straight to AAA to see what he has.

He'll never hit many XHB but he's a contact styled hitter who was dubbed the "fastest base runner" in the system by BA. If he could OPS around 700 in the majors (probably a stretch right now unless he matures more this year) while stealing lots of bases and playing solid D, he would be valuable.

We'll just have to see what he can do this year but he's easily the closest MLB SS prospect that the Giants have. Bocock was thurst (heh) into the majors by Omars injury when he should still be in A-ball.

[April 17, 2008 1:54 PM]  |  link  |  reply
Chris replied to ELM

One more thing, I was trying to think of a good player comp to Burriss. Maybe our best case scenario would be Cesar Izturis' 2004 season: .288/.330/.381 with 25 stolen bases. That season was good for an OPS+ of 88. He might not be as good as Izturis was defensively, but I bet that he could swipe more than 25 bags over 700 PA's.

Here's PECOTA's Top 10 Similarity Scores for Manny

1 Wylie Campbell
2 Shawn Livsey
3 Freddie Bynum
4 Chone Figgins
5 Juan Francia
6 Willie Bloomquist
7 Cleatus Davidson
8 Justin Baughman
9 Alfredo Amezaga
10 Chris Burke

Not much there. Mostly speed guys with little power that if they made it, made it as utility players. Who's the top comp on this list, Figgins? Burke was a 1 pick in '01 but was never really given much more than a PT role with the Astros and it looks like he may have peeked in '06.

[April 17, 2008 1:26 PM]  |  link  |  reply
obsessivegiantscompulsive said

Anybody getting the Johnny "Boo" LeMaster vibe? :^)

I like Zobrist too, I mentioned his name in comments somewhere before. The main problem is that I recall that Tampa Bay has a high opinion on all their players, so they are hard to trade with. And with Price and Neimann coming up, they might hold out for more for Zobrist. Plus, as nice as Brignac is, there's no guarantee that he'll pan out in the majors, heck, no guarantee that Zobrist will either, on our end. Still, if we can get away with trading one of our A-league pitchers for him, I think that would be a good gamble.

I've been never impressed with Lillibridge. Better than our prospects, so I guess that's the attraction, but I wouldn't give up a good prospect for him. I would rather have Zobrist, talent-wise, though trading with the Braves is probably an easier avenue.

I was wondering about the Burriss rush up, now it makes more sense, they want to see if he can make the jump to the majors in 2009. Everyone notes his A+ problems, but he admitted in an interview that he didn't properly prepare himself last off-season, and only got himself straight in Augusta.

Plus, he did pretty well in the Arizona Fall League last year. The competition there is greater, to me, than AAA, because all the teams' best prospects are playing each other there. Whereas the competing pitchers are not always at the highest talent levels when you are playing everyday in AA or AAA.

And they are committed to him playing SS still, he will still get starts there in AAA, but will play 2B mainly in 2008, probably because they are hoping that he can be the utility MI next season, plus they are hoping that maybe he can also compete for starting SS.

I wouldn't worry about him right now not hitting. If it continues into May, then I would worry.

I wonder why Ochoa wasn't given any consideration. Yeah, bad bat for a long time, but Velez had a bad bat too until he got to the Giants. Ochoa had his best season hitting in AAA for us in 2007, plus he is supposedly superior defensively. I guess they thought his bat last year was a fluke.

Aurilia has been named numerous times as the go-to SS if the need arises. Fits with his utilty duties.

Unless we can trade for a SS without giving up a good prospect, I think it'll be better to go with internal choices. Let them all battle and see who gets the chance. And I would have no problem with the Giants just yo-yo-ing them in 2009, playing whoever seems to be hot at that moment.

Free agents, is Furcal the only good SS free right now? It might be good to get him on a ST deal like the Dodgers did for more money. And they have Hu at SS waiting in AAA (I wouldn't mind trading for him) so they might let Furcal go free agency and try Hu at SS (first base!).

[April 17, 2008 6:36 PM]  |  link  |  reply
Frank said

After last year, I had high hopes for Ochoa, but he was awful in ST and the awfulness continues in Fresno. It seems the only bona fide SS is Furcal, whose play also very nicely suits the style of play we are trying to get to. 2-3 years of Furcal, letting Burriss, Bocock, et al try to find some offensive skills may be the best option. I say that not knowing that much about Lillibridge, et al, but my impression is one of them might turn into a league avg SS. I hope we can do better than aspire to league average.

[April 17, 2008 7:27 PM]  |  link  |  reply
Victor said

My hope right now is that maybe Bocock can turn into a Vizquel. When Vizquel first came up, his bat was not all that great but through the years it's gotten better so who knows! So maybe with the extra BP and actual experience at the major league level, Bocock can turn into something. Realistically the Giants probably will sign someone for a two year contract or so next year (no 35+ please!) and wait for Burriss or Bocock.