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When the Giants Come to Town, It's Bye-Bye Baby | |
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When the Giants Come to Town, It's Bye-Bye Baby | |
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Giants 40-Man Roster
(w/2010 Salary, if known) PITCHERS
Affeldt (4.5 M)Bumgarner Cain (4.5 M) Hinshaw Joaquin S. Johnson Lincecum J. Martinez Medders (.85 M) Pucetas Romo Runzler J. Sanchez (2.1 M) H. Sosa B. Wilson (4.4 M) Zito (18.5 M) CATCHERS
Molina (4.5 M)
PoseyWhiteside INFIELDERS
BurrissDeRosa (6 M) Downs Frandsen Gillaspie Huff (3 M) Ishikawa Pill Renteria (10 M) Rohlinger F. Sanchez (6 M) Sandoval Uribe (3.25 M) Velez OUTFIELDERS
BowkerFord Lewis Peguero Rowand (13.6 M) Schierholtz Torres OTHER
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Lincecum, hands down.
And I'm still grateful to Schmidt for what he did for us, and I'm grateful to the Dodgers for paying him for the work he did for us previously. :^)
I never purged him, but I don't look at him and think of him very fondly, after all, he did the Brett Butler and talked about how it was a dream come true to join them (and I think Kent makes three). So, what, being with the Giants was chopped liver?
That's why I think it's funny that Kent is reaching back to the Giants now that his career is over, he apparently wants some connection, but (and he claims he was taken out of context) the things he said about the Giants and its fans are pretty much bridge burners, as far as I'm concerned. It would take huge mea culpas, starting with his publicly apologizing for popping a wheeler on his bike and hurting himself.
Schmidt was diminished, you were right, and often injured. That the training staff got him healthy enough to still start all those games is a testament to how well they handled him, particularly that year his elbow was hanging by a thread (I still don't get Franchez-gate, I'm sure they knew he was hurt, just that they probably thought that there was 80% chance of keeping him healthy, kind of like with Schmidt and his elbow; sometimes when you take a risk, it bites you in the butt). Testament to his grit too.
Just because he got into all those starts doesn't mean that he wasn't hurting from injuries, he was able to battle through them, that's all.
And he was diminished, we all knew it, his K/9 took a big hit, and his velocity was down and he was pitching on guile and fumes.
I believe that Lincecum is the better pitcher of the two (by a reasonable margin too) but things get awkward if you want the Giant's pitcher of the decade.
Lincecum has played for the Giants for only a quarter of the past decade versus Schmidt being here for just over half. All that extra playing time has to make up for some of the deficit in talent and lets not forget that Schmidt was really good himself (maybe not Lincecum good) for three years.
While I think Lincecum is better, I think due to the extra playing time and high level he played at that Schmidt could probably be classed as the Giant's "pitcher of the decade".
Lincecum is the clear front-runner already for "pitcher of the next decade" not just in terms of Giants but all of baseball.
Best Giants pitcher of the decade. Not who did the most, produced the most. Who is best? Lincecum, as you noted clearly at the beginning of your comment.
Now, if ELM asked what you wrote, "Giants pitcher of the decade" I can buy your argument for Schmidt. But Lincecum is the Best Giants pitcher of the decade, hands down, heck, best Giants pitcher in the SF Giants franchise history, and if he can continue doing this for the rest of his time with the Giants, the entire Giants franchise history.
And yes, very astute, he is clearly lined up to be the best pitcher period of the 2010's.
Schmidt was excellent for two or three years, and above average for two more. That's a great run. Lincecum has been arguably the best pitcher in baseball for two years, and above average for ~1/2 season more (his debut season).
If you take absolute peak performance, Lincecum wins. But shouldn't longevity count for something?
Here's one way to look at it. In his 2.5 years, Lincecum has been worth an astounding $83 million. In five years with SF, not including the last part of 2001 (no data for that), Schmidt was worth $75 million. You can adjust for inflation, but it still seems Lincecum has outperformed Schmidt in half the time.
Another tidbit to consider: Schmidt's post-season work. I only remembered the great start in 2003, but looking back he wasn't so dominant in 2002.
Lefty,
You've pointed out the discrepancy in the monetized value (according to fangraphs) of Tim vs. Jason. Here is another discrepancy: Jason on Giants: $75 millon value for $37.4 million cost, or $2.005 for every dollar spent. Jason on the doggers: $0 value for $47 million cost, or...wait, sorry, I can't divide by 0. In any case, I find this kind of endearing.
ps. Viewed in this way, Tim is off the fucking charts.
Jason Schmidt. His 2003-2004 peak was comparable to Lincecum's 2008-09, and he had a bunch of other solid seasons, too.
Timmy will make up for it, though -- pitcher of the next decade!
TIMMMMMY WINS AGAIN. How much more $$ will that cost us. I'll report what his dad has to say later.
Lincecum, without question.
Jason Schmidt...........another example of Sabean Epic Fail. Refused to trade him in his walk year and got nothing for him, when he could've gotten a prospect or two.
Would that all of Sabean's fails worked out like Jason Schmidt: trade for an erratic 28-year-old pitcher who's never had an ERA under 4, give up two nothing youngsters in the deal, watch him go 7-1 after the trade, sign him to an expensive and highly speculative five-year deal (even after his hot finish in 2001, dude still hadn't posted a yearly ERA under 4), watch him become the best Giants pitcher since Marichal and be worth twice his salary, walk away before he breaks down, collect two top-43 draft picks, get the Dodgers' first round pick and take a pitcher that quickly shoots onto Top 50 lists, and watch as the Dodgers throw $47M at Schmidt and get nothing for their investment.
I love that story!
You want Sabean fail? Use one of those picks on a comical overdraft like Jackson Williams, trade the other drafted player for an injured rental infielder, and then overpay the infielder with a two-year extension.